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27174 No. 27174
I'm sorry Ponychan, but I really need to vent.

I'm sick and tired of sexism on the Internet, and in IRL too. I'm a female brony, and for some reason lately I've been noticing it more and more now. I don't want to to go into detail in fear of a long-flank rant, but basically I keep seeing misogynic or just plain ignoring comments all over the place, and every time I try to intelligently discuss this with them I just get blown off because I'm female. I'm a fairly intelligent person, but in school and in social environments whenever I hang out with guys they always treat me like I'm not as smart as they are and it really upsets me...

Do any other female (or male even) bronies feel where I'm coming from? I'm not sure what I want from this thread, but I feel like the pony community is more accepting than the real world. Here it's like most of the community is genderless (although there's likely a disproportionate amount of males here) and that's what makes conversation and discussion so easy.

In addition, I also find that I really like MLP:FiM because of this too. Unlike other little girls' (yes, little girls) shows, I find that FiM doesn't center around traditionally girly scenarios, and has a lot of positive role models for young girls.

Maybe I could just ask for some cheering up, or discussion on the matter, or maybe just a Rainbow Dash thread or something.

Also, this isn't just a "I hate men, everypony hates me because I'm a girl" thing...I'm honestly not convinced all guys are this way or that I'm at some horrible adversity.... just some dumbasses on the Internet pissing me off.
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>> No. 27175
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Maybe I am overreacting..
>> No. 27176
Nah. As a fembrony myself, I get upset with the sexism and stuff too. (The only time I'M in the kitchen is if I'm raiding the fridge.)
>> No. 27177
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Go oN....
>> No. 27178
Like I said few times before, the internet, IT industry, creative industry in general are hopelessly male dominant.

This is a very difficult topic to talk about.

Take a look at this video.

Feminism's goals are NOT complete yet.
>> No. 27179
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>just some dumbasses on the Internet pissing me off.

Most of them are just paraspriting but then again they usually don't listen anyways.
>> No. 27180
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I kinda get where you're coming from, and consider Lauren Faust herself would agree with you too lol. Though in my experience pop culture tends to favor the girls over the guys in terms of smarts lol.

I'll stick around if you wanna vent it out, always enjoy learning about people. Though as a guy I haven't experienced this, so I may not always understand XD

>also game of picture unrelated?
>> No. 27181
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I definitely agree there's a misogynist climate in our society. Maybe it's because I'm living in a small town, but I hear comments like "Women are just illogical, don't bother trying to understand them" all the time. Most of this isn't based on actual thinking, but following the group or self-actualisation. Not sure what to do about it, when called out for this behaviour most just brush it off as something they don't really mean, although they do so subconsciously.
FiM shows girls that have jobs and live an independent life, so it's pretty refreshing. Any show that has actual characterisation is refreshing, for that matter.

So all I really can say is, don't let it get you down, though I don't know what you could do.
>> No. 27182
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It is the result of the Internet F*ckwad Theory.

People have a tendency to say and do things on the internet that they normally wouldn't in real life. Most of time it is simply for the sake of making people angry.

Sorry that this is happening to you, not all of us are like that.
>> No. 27183
Thanks for reminding me, I need to restock.

Anyway, I'm against sexism in general, in that both males and females can be either intelligent or flankholes. I support any female brony, and I'm a guy!
>> No. 27184
Sounds like just some parasprites. Sorry you have to deal with that.
>> No. 27185
So you're derpy? Sorry couldn't resist
>> No. 27186
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I'm a female and I really dislike females so I can't really say anything. I could go into a rant why dislike a lot of them but... Lol. Kitchen jokes and all that jazz don't piss me off or anything because they are parasprites and they don't know anything about women if they all think they are not in the internet. Sometimes I get annoyed when people don't listen to what I say because I am a female but that is rarely because the sites I go to or anywhere, they listen. Now... some other boards, I wouldn't have this luck.
>> No. 27187
Sorry, you said in real life too. Sorry that happens to you, people can be complete asshats about garbage like that. As much as it hurts, don't let it get to you and know that sometimes people say these things to cover their own insecurities.
>> No. 27188
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I'm a 25-year-old male and a huge fan of a cartoon aimed primarily at 4-12 year-old girls.

We all have our stereotypes and norms we have to break through. Hayters gonna hayte.
>> No. 27189
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Personally, I don't believe you are overreacting. There are many people who look down on others in real life, and on the internet that amount increases significantly, due to the ability to remain anonymous.

Although I have never been the target of sexism before, I do have been a victim of several other things, such as bullying and harrassment. I found that the best solution was to simply ignore the people who do it. This may sound cliché, but the sole reason people look down on others is to protect their own fragile ego.

I hope that my post has been somewhat helpful, and I hope you feel better soon.
>> No. 27190
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Just for the mere sake of explanation you need to keep in mind that you'd get a same reaction or two in real life at least in one singularity.

it's just one of those things that are bound to annoy us.

for instance so far over the internet I've been mocked for:
my religion
my hair
my musical taste
my taste in television programming
my sense of humor
the way I talk
the way I look
(not on ponychan)

it's easier to shake off than in real life..so i guess thats the only thing I can really say.

tl;dr people are dicks.
>> No. 27191

I am. I'm on a quest to find a muffin in my fridge. Nothing yet... *stares at fridge, checks, comes back*

Still no.
>> No. 27192
Totally agree with you there. It gets extremely annoying at times. I've learned too pretty much ignore it though.
>> No. 27193
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I have had cupcakes in the freezer, but never a muffin in the fridge.

What's wrong with the world? XD
>> No. 27194
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The internet is often a terribly biased place. What you said rings true, the Ponychan community turns a rather blind eye to gender and that is largely because of the material it is based on. MLP:FiM is wonderful because it serves to break down a lot of these gender barriers: Males and females both love the show.

Here, everypony is loved and nopony is ever disregarded.
>> No. 27195
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I see where you're coming from. I'm a guy, but most of my friends have been females, or pony males. I know what you mean when you say most men don't take female seriously because guys feel like they run most stuff. They feel like guys do guy things and have guy issues. and Girls have Girl issues. Not saying that isn't true, but Girls can have valid points and ideas to a situation that may be only seen from a guy point of view. And vice-versa! I just want you to know that not most guys are like that. I know there are somethings that can be done that from any gender. And anypony should be able to help, have an opinion, or heck even know more about that thing! And should be valued as such! I hope this helped! I just want you to know that I love you and hope you feel better!!!
>> No. 27196

On a site where guys freely express their love for ponies, I don't think you have to worry about "hurr durr female on the internet - TITS OR GTFO" around these parts. :p
>> No. 27197

On a site where guys freely express their love for ponies, I don't think you have to worry about "hurr durr female on the internet - TITS OR GTFO" around these parts. :p
>> No. 27198
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not to derail ... but wouldn't a female brony just be called a pony... . . . ?

but sexism is like a two sided blade. its used by both sexes as an excuse and a crutch. though if your friends arent treating you as an equal then are they your friends? especially if they arent respecting your intelligence...

and yes it is a good show for little girls... and men 17-25 ... <___<;;

also heres some dash. cheer up, buttercup.
>> No. 27199
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I try to treat everypony the same.

I have one "true" female friend and well, ive pretty much treated her as i have all my other (male) friends. But i have often seen her at the subject of sexism too, but she always had a pretty good comeback.
>> No. 27200
If anything is hateful around here that isn't an obvious parasprite, it's the Ponychan server....D:
>> No. 27201
Not according to the Ponychan word filter. To be called "pony" is to either A) be "happy" in the traditional sense or be two males that like playing hide the sausage. >___>

Wordfilter, you se oatmeal.
>> No. 27202
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>> No. 27203
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Oh wow, a quick trip to the bathroom and I come back to a bunch of stuff. XD

Thanks for the comments guys.
This is what I hate about the world. Whoever seems to dominate an area always decides that they can say whatever they want about the other group without it being hurtful, when in reality it hurts even more. While I understand it more in areas where there aren't a lot of women, sometimes I wonder if thats what perpetuates that. For example, people often say that there are no women in the gaming realm or on the Internet, but I know for a fact that there are a hell of a lot more of them than we think they are that simply don't state their gender. They do this because they know they'll get harassed because of it, and in the end it's just making everything worse! This can be said for careers too, as male-dominated careers tend to be male-dominated for a long time until some sort of "social revolution" takes place.

I think the reason that women often appear as "smart" in pop culture is because of the fact that it's the opposite of what happens in real life. People in the movie and TV (etc) industries like to make characters that defy the ordinary, because that makes them interesting. Because of this we often see the archetype of "career woman" or "hot nerdy girl" or "spunky and witty female". I don't know. It's not even the smartness thing either. I'm always seeing sexism in little things, like when guys complain about their girlfriends' incessant needs to talk about feelings. Why is this a bad thing? Sure, it's different between genders and I understand that, but sometimes guys patronize women so much because they are more "sensitive" than they are. It's a bunch of these tiny little inferiority complexes people create that causes men to look down on us.

Ugh, I hate that comment so much. Not just from men, but from women too. Whenever somepony tries to validify their sexism by saying the other gender is just "illogical" causes such a gap in the sexes that it creates more intolerance. Sure, there might be incomprehensible differences in the genders of the human species, but that doesn't mean we need to look down on anypony.

That's fine. See, I understand that people often say things on the Internet that they would never say in real life, but that doesn't make it any better to me. It just makes it evident that they're thinking these things IRL but are too afraid to say them. The fact that anypony should be having these thoughts in the first place pisses me off, because our society is supposed to be beyond that. I feel like women and other minorities haven't made nearly as much progress as we think we have,and that we've just made the other side be more quiet about it!

See, I have a tendency to dislike females too. I dislike a lot of stereotypical and common girly habits that tend to inhabit the masses, and I don't mind a few gender-related jokes. "Get back in the kitchen" jokes and the like don't bother me, and I too find them funny, but what does irk me is when people go beyond just joking. When it gets to the point that I can't have an intelligent discussion whilst making my gender known whether it be online or with a group of trusted friends without being made feel like I'm amongst a group of superior beings is when I wonder if people are really joking in these scenarios, or if they're just making a joke of me.

Sorry if I didn't get everypony, I tried to hit the people who I thought of lengthly responses for, and if you didn't get responded to and still want to discuss you can still respond, I don't mind. I'm not even sure if everypony I responded to is willing to read that long blurb of annoyed venting, but it's making me feel better at least.
>> No. 27204
>That's fine. See, I understand that people often say things on the Internet that they would never say in real life, but that doesn't make it any better to me. It just makes it evident that they're thinking these things IRL but are too afraid to say them. The fact that anypony should be having these thoughts in the first place pisses me off, because our society is supposed to be beyond that. I feel like women and other minorities haven't made nearly as much progress as we think we have,and that we've just made the other side be more quiet about it!

It is indeed a shame that we still live in a time of ignorance, I agree with you wholeheartedly on that.
>> No. 27205
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the correct term is she-brony
also make me a sandwhich
>> No. 27206
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I find kinda annoying when for example playing a video game and girl talks to microphone or is just known to be girl by community or whatever that all the guys go like "WOAH GIRL IN THE INTERWEB, WHERE DO YOU LIVE, ARE YOU HAWT" and then there is all this kitchen stuff etc. Is it really that hard to act like he is just an another person or something? Personally I treat people at least I try my best equally be they male or female.
>> No. 27207

This is why I never use a mic/use male avatars and stuff.

It's just sooo immature and gets really annoying.
>> No. 27208
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Also due to the Homer Simpson effect, but alas, my HS was full of intelligent girls, probably more-so than normal. I can't really explain it, but most of the guys just didn't take school seriously. Then again, it was split up both by grade and actual academic level so who knows lol.
>> No. 27209
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Stop taking the internet seriously.

>> No. 27210
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Yeah. Big reason I dislike female gamers. I game all the time and when a girl comes in, trying to flaunt her gender and gets whatever her want. If I actually try to tell them they are being stupid or how foolish they are being, they ban me or something. I do not like women flaunting their gender to get things or whatever. Ugh. Or if I talk in microphone, they instantly say I sound like a dude because my voice is not as high pitch as all the other girls around me. Or I am too good of a gamer and too quiet to be a girl.

Uh whatever?
>> No. 27211
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21 year old male brony here. I don't know why there are people out there who think that the female populus is stupid or should be ignored. I mean, unless they ignore everypony, it's just stupid and bucked up.

>Totally ignored every post besides the OP
>> No. 27212
read OP

>and in IRL too.
Its in the second paragraph, first sentence lol

*hug* XD
>> No. 27213
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Not sure if that's the solution. I get how it seems easier to just assume a male identity, but this just reinforces the "male is the neutral gender on the internet" point of view.

>pic related
>> No. 27214

Of course it's not the solution, I just do it too AVOID all of the annoying conflict. I think it's best too ignore it. That's just me though.
>> No. 27215
Eh, John Sappington Marmaduke doesn't get a vibe from type about gender until it becomes obvious. Like say, they go ahead and say what gender they are.

Could be that he just doesn't have very good perception.
>> No. 27216
I mean, if they're good friends, it's still all in good fun. If I know a girl well I'd make jokes sure, but only if I'm sure she knows I'm joking. The internet kinda takes away the "friend" part unfortunately.
>> No. 27217
The common and prevalent stereotypes of women being 'illogical, emotional, non-tech savvy' won't die anytime soon, I am sorry to say.

Take a look at some interesting sites.


I wish I could link more, but I can't seem to find them at the moment.
>> No. 27219
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I like to think I have a good comeback when I try, but what annoys me is that usually good comebacks don't change anything. I hate knowing that no matter what I say, if I'm talking to a sexist they're just going to walk away thinking "that bitch is crazy" or something and never change their ways.

In my eyes, brony isn't a gender-specific term. While it did originate from "bro", it has the same usage as "anon" or simply "member". Differentiating between the sexes just causes separation in two groups that don't need clarification.
But in response to what you were actually saying, the thing is that my friends aren't meaning to do it. It's not like they right-out say "you're dumb because you're a girl". I think the reason I feel this attitude from them is because they're growing up in a society where the manestream beliefs allows them to think this way subconsciously. I fear that it's becoming a culturally okay thing to place women in a place of interior intelligence or men in a place of less eloquent manners or any other sort of gender stereotype to become prevalent. I don't like it. I feel like it all roots back to what I was saying about brony vs. pony, in that we feel the need to differentiate between groups that don't need to be separated in all circumstances.

This is why I came here to do this. See, I feel like if I tried to have this discussion almost anywhere else on the Internet, even relatively docile places, I'd find myself faced with the very types of people I'm mad at. I love this place because I think we truly live under a doctrine of "love everypony", and I feel like the world should be the same.

Thanks so much for your input. I feel like venting about this not only makes me feel better, but makes people have to think about gender differences. I don't like to be associated with "feminists" who try to diss on men all the time, because that's not what I'm fighting for. I too recognize that the sexes have differences and that there are things that can differentiate us, but this very understanding gets abused in the minds of our society. I don't know...I'm just mad. But thank you c:
>> No. 27221
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I know where you're coming from but you know what they say about arguing over the internet.
Personally I don't think that happens here (for the most part)
And IRL, fuck if I'm sick of it. I don't want to go into a long rant cause personally I don't think I've had it that bad but I've seen it happen to other people. also I've got things to do right now. maybe later...
>> No. 27222
These things go both ways. As a guy, I dislike the stereotype that /all/ men have only two braincells to rub together and not much else. While some men are hopeless halfwits that communicate through either grunting, thinking with our "lower brain" or by belching - the entire gender doesn't adhere to this.

And to be fair, some women do deserve the tr0ll treatment. Feminazis are some of the most illlogicall things on the planet..anything with a penis is suddenly the bad guy. oo To a feminazi, their version of equality is for a government body or anything with infueunce really to push women up top and to punish men. Which, of course, is no better than the existing sexism problem to begin with - only swapped.

PS: Please stop using terms like "minority" - it's a slap to the face that only exaggurates differences that should be trivial in 2011. Also, how can women be a minority anyway if they make up roughly 50% of the human population...?
>> No. 27223
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People call me crazy the whole time!
I guess I'm crazy! Well you are talking about stupid, but people also call me stupid. It's funny. Just because I talk in class and people get pissed off and they talk in class and not a single fuck is given. It's kinda unfair and I'm rambeling. Um... yeah...
>pic related, people probably think I'm just like this thing, constantly spouting random thoughts out of my mouth...
>> No. 27224
I live in a small town in South Carolina, I've seen basically every kind of ignorance and idiocy that Americans can cook up. People are just damn stupid sometimes, but a lot of times, it's because they were raised by people who had these views strongely themselves, or actually live in conditions where all the stereotypes are true.
Like for instance, 90 % of this cities blacks fall PERFECTLY into stereotypes, thus creating masses of people who are racist and don't even know it.

Fact is discrimination against women is as strong as ever, a women in today's society is still commonly seen facing adversity in the work place and common day life, and the side of society that reflects 4chan even comes out in some people.

I'm thinking, a long flank time ago, men's physical superiority and tendency for the logical side of the brain over emotional led to men being seen as the capable beings, and women as inferior. End of discussion, inferior beings, this stereotype was denied by several cultures of course, but the traces of it exist thousands of years later. Some men still believe the whole, "the wife should listen to me" BS. Half of the sexist people in the world don't even know they do it!

Even worse are the masses of sexist women in today's world, my English teacher is always making horribly racist remarks against my race(male) almost daily, nopony seems to care though, because she's a girl and she's talking bad about guys.

Girls are allowed to be sexist if they want, blacks are allowed to be racist if they want. Most of the males you meet on the street ARE sexist to a small degree. Sexism is apparently also super-duper okay compared to racism. Let there by BoyVSGirl quizzes, arguments at lunch over which is better! It's disgusting, people never see past sex, even when they do race or religion.

TL;DR : This is basically me just randomely ranting. I hate the racism and sexism that's still do damn present in today's world. The GIANT list of double standards at the staggering amounts of bigotry is disgusting.

Also, half of my damn family is racist against blacks and Mexicans.
>> No. 27225
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I'm running out of the ability to respond individually, so Imma just lump things together into more rants!

<3 First off, everypony here is making me so happy just by responding and participating in intelligent discussion. Thank you guys so much.

Secondly, I'd like to point out that I'm not ranting about petty things like "go make me a sandwich" type jokes. Those are funny because they reflect on an ideology that people usually recognize as unacceptable in a satirical fashion. What makes me mad is the subtle sexism that shows up outside of the Internet, and of course online too.

Gaming also annoys me. While I'm annoyed by the type of female who gets online and flaunts her gender for free stuff or for attention, this type of person only exists because of these sexists attitudes. If people never decided that female gamers were a rare treasure that needed to be doted on and treated like a queen (or the opposite, treated like some sort of anomaly that shouldn't be taken seriously) then these types of women would never exist. If women were treated the same as any other gamer, people wouldn't go online flaunting their gender....they would just go online to play games.

In addition, a large reason we don't have as many female gamers is because games are largely directed towards men. Why is it that women characters always scamp around in bikinis when their male counterparts have crazy huge armor and helmets? It's because women are seen as sex objects all over the media, and for some reason we're okay with it.

Sadly, I know it won't go away. This is why I get so frustrated. While I'm not the type to go around protesting for feminism and trying to end the male species, I really hate the fact that it's blatantly okay to insult or characterize women. If men want to go around talking about how all girls are bitches and horsees, people agree and move on. If I want to say (which I don't) that men are all assholes who cheat and lie, people instantly label me as a bitch.

Great links by the way. I actually did a similar topic to this for my senior research paper, and I wish I had had some of these for examples.
>> No. 27226
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There is this widespread notion that the feminism of the twentieth century largely achieved its goal and that any feminists existing today are simply zealots who are out to build a gender dictatorship the opposite way. This idea is largely adopted by young women who see it as a way to separate themselves from their parents.
Feminism hasn't achieved its goal - making the idea of what it means to be a woman acceptable in society - halfway and resorting to pointing out minor groups of feminists doesn't help, it's the same as equaling fundamentalist muslims with Islam in general.

Sorry if this reads angry, I'm not angry. I'm not trying to say that all feminists today are saints, but to get back to the actual subject.
>> No. 27227
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Noo... I'm sorry NeverGoBak! I love you and I wish your family would get over that. And met me! I'm Black and I think your awesome!
>> No. 27228
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I'm not trying to argue over the internet at all, in fact I only brought this post here because I knew Ponychan was tolerant enough to discuss it rationally with me. I'm not finding ANY sexism in Ponychan itself, actually quite the opposite. I'm mostly just venting/discussing here.

I hate male sexism too, don't get me wrong. I'm not trying to say that females are the only ones who get this sort of behavior, but it's what I have the most experience with.
As far as feminazi's go, I couldn't agree more. I don't like it when women use their own bad experiences as a means to do the same thing at the "other side".

If I was using minority or the like in that context, I really didn't mean to. I don't support that kind of mindset, but I may have dropped the term in order to bring in other types of discrimination into my points (i.e. women and minorities). If I used the term in that way, I promise I didn't intend to. ^^ I'm not a feminazi, trust me.


Thanks for the long reply, actually! I don't mind XD I promise /glances to my own novels
I agree that racism is also a huge problem. In general, I'm just sick of intolerance all over the world. As I've said previously, if the world ran like Ponychan, everything would be great.
>> No. 27229
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This. Million times this.
Feminism is NOWHERE near achieving its goals.

Also, read this and weep/cry/laugh/etc. It's pretty embarrassing as fuck.
>> No. 27230
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I could not agree with this more, thank you very much.
>> No. 27231
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Dear god. XD This actually made me laugh a lot, but at the same time cry just a little tiny bit on the inside because of how pathetic the human species is getting. (Note; I am NOT calling men pathetic- this is a comment on people in general)
>> No. 27233
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Well, I'm a guy. Honestly, I have absolutely nothing against women. In fact, in most of my life until more recently most of my friends have been female, and the fact that not many are now is just because I've moved, etc. I do not hate girls in the least, especially not for being girls.

I'm just not, uh... romantically attracted to them. I swing the other way.

But! I don't think that necessarily goes hand in hand with things. I've met a lot of guys who are good friends with girls and listen to what they say, etc. even though they don't always agree. But then, I tend to hang out with people who are mostly level-headed.

When people ignore comments, I'd say, maybe it isn't necessarily gender-related, and they either just missed the comment (I know, it's happened to me before too) or they're just being a jerk to everypony regardless of gender :)

That being said, it has never, ever made sense to me why somepony would hate or dislike another person based on gender, or race. I was raised in Alabama, but I was also raised color-blind so to speak. Racism made no sense to me, never did, never will, and sexism is along the same lines. In my personal view, frankly, maturity tends to bring out the same basic qualities in people regardless of gender: thoughtfulness, patience, etc.

So, while I can't say I've particularly noticed what you have, I can understand where you're coming from, and can reassure you that at least form this corner of the internet, y'all ladies have a friend in me :D
>> No. 27234
This thread..it's...it's...alive! Wait..it's still alive..? :D

I thought this vanished off of /oat/ [spoiler]FOREVER[/B] already. Nice to know discussion is still going on. I hope I didn't annoy anypony with my comments. There are still gender roles in existance, but it always pleases me when I see a girl into "guy stuff." Gender should not matter, but how you relate to a person as an invidual does.

For me, I'm not a fan of girly girls. The spazzing over weight constantly, mall trips, omigawd..the whole nine yards. Gimme a girl that isn't afraid to eat and that wants to kick my flank at games. <3 Personal preference because I can relate better. Some guys like shopping and pampering themselves..I wouldn't be eager to hang with them just cause we're bros. - Personal choice rules all. None of that "you can't do that because you're a boy" / "you're a girl, act like one" manure that society tries to impose on everypony.

If I'm gonna like or not like somepony, it's because of who they are - not whether or not there is a gentlemans sausage between their legs.
>> No. 27235
File 130468543918.jpg - (55.77KB , 400x300 , Dont_look_at_me_like_that.jpg )
Spoiler tag derp...cut me some slack, I'm sleepy.
>> No. 27236
None of us actually have anything against women. Thing is, the thought of liking the show is somewhat threatening to the masculinity of us males, and so we cover it up by exaggerating its manliness. Some people may have taken that too far - I don't know, I didn't see it. They should tone it down. But know that IRL nopony here has anything against women.
>> No. 27237
It's the intro, mate. "My little pony~ My little pooooony~" It's hard to be all hardcore with that. :P

Anyway, I know males like to joke that FiM is the manliest thing ever and to like it without shame because you far more secure with your sexuality than the "Wut r yew a gawd damn coltcuddleret?" twits. (which is true) - The /real/ most manliest thing a man can do is take care of his family.
>> No. 27238
>implying the intro isnt badass manly as well
Seriously, ive been humming it everywhere
>> No. 27239
wordfilter and bad grammar..ok ok..I get the hint I need sleep. STOP RUBBING IT IN PONYCHAN!

>is emosad ///_;
>> No. 27240
File 130469594933.png - (105.49KB , 945x945 , I understand that emotion brethren.png )
You girls aren't the only ones that have pressure or are looked at differently because of your gender. For me it's not as bad as your situation, but still.. It's there.

I meet people and because of my gender and look they think i'm this guy that has no feelings, won't take shit, and is an asshole. MOSTLY because of my muscles. I'm really a nice, kind guy. I would let things slide, I'm very diplomatic about situations.. and DEFINITELY not an asshole.

I mean they expect me to be this manly wall that has no feelings or that can take anything. People expect me to always want to do ONLY manly things. They expect me to not be me. I don't like that about society... The sad thing is.. We all do it. It's just something about out human perception. Which makes me envy blind people in a way, Even though I could never do it. Oh man life and all of it's colors and environment and stuff HNNNNNG~ But they determine a person by how they act towards them, the way they are kind of.
>Obviously, I met a blind chick as of late and experienced this. I LAUGHED SO HARD WHEN I PUT RED GLASSES ON HER. >Homestuck reference.
>But yeah, She's nice. A good friend.

But besides that whole point, I mean it's like I want to have some emotions too, I don't wanna be MANLY all the time. Even though I usually AM in social places. Confound you society.

But I just want to be treated like a normal guy. Because inside, I'm a human being. Not a wall.
>Also I'm a pretty cool guy I THINK. I'm not sure.
>> No. 27241
File 130469619171.jpg - (253.54KB , 794x652 , ST__Catain__s_Peril_by_BeastBoyRox746.jpg )
Coming out of lurk mode to hug

>*hug* =D
>> No. 27242
When I look back on our history as a society, I think we have come a long way towards teaching young girls and women that their worth is not determined by their gender or feminine ideals or how attractive they are to the opposite sex. This show does a great job of showing the worth of all kinds of girls, without needing to be validated by the approval of males.

This is a good thing. But it's obvious that alone will never give us the ideal of equality.

The more I observe guys on the internet and in real life, I start to wonder if what we're missing is that they've been left behind. We've neglected to teach boys the same about themselves while growing up. To reassure them that their worth is in who they are, and NOT determined by how well they fit into masculine expectations and how successful they are with women.

Boys are often still taught to believe that they are always supposed to be in control of their own worth in those areas. But if they can't get approval from women - other human beings one can never really control - they are taught to consider themselves worthless at the same time.

This contradiction creates an immense amount of frustration and confusion. Some men are driven to conclude the only way to assure success is to control women. And that's what keeps bringing sexism back.

For as hard as women have fought to overcome the stereotypes that limited us, our society now needs to fight just as hard to liberate men from essentially the same stereotypes that still hold them down.

I realize there are guys who probably won't want to let go of these stereotypes, because they believe it's worked well for them in the past and they've internalized them so deeply, or maybe they fear becoming weak. But maybe instead they will truly feel confident in who they really are, and they won't be so desperate to validate themselves in their own minds and among other men, through the belittlement and control of women.

As a woman, I can only look at things from my own gender's perspectives in this society. But I do try to understand the other side, and these have been my thoughts on the matter so far. Guys, let me know how you feel about this, and if I have said anything offensive or if I'm grossly mistaken.
>> No. 27243
Personally I don't think stereotypes are just a guy thing. I think we're still often feeding girls stereotypes as well to be honest. That's part of why I like MLP:FiM - it isn't like all the other girl's shows out there which basically try to cookie-cutter girls into barbie-dolls.

Really, guys and girls are still characterized by stereotypes. I never liked things like "battle of the sexes" or whatnot, because I'm not convinced at all that their "differences" need to put them at odds. I never have been, really, I've always been of the mind that even from an early age they should (be allowed to) enjoy each other's company and work together just like they would those of the same gender. It's like Lauren herself said - it's a tragedy that it's considered bad for a little boy to like things made for little girls, or vice versa.

I think part of the reason the whole "battle of the sexes" mentality has come about has been due to "Stereotype training." People saying whether direct or indirect, by example or by teaching, "This is normal, this is what's expected of you." "Men can't understand emotions," and "Women aren't rational, they are blubbering puddles of tears." or "Men shouldn't care about appearances except where a girl is involved," and "Women take inordinate amounts of time in the bathroom." "Men can't like lacy or frilly things." "Girls should like everything cute and cuddly." I mean honestly, you see that everywhere.

My other pet peeve is the "rules of etiquette" - My family basically tried to teach me to treat women like princesses across the board and basically ignoring men beyond basic politeness. That should never be how it is, and it's the wrong motivation.

Frankly, I'm a lot more practical: Help anypony who needs it regardless of gender with a good attitude. Try your best not to be offensive to others where it's reasonable. The person you're helping can be a girl or a guy, it doesn't matter. If you're in a crowd and somepony else reaches the door before you? Who opens it and who holds it doesn't really matter so long as everypony is enjoying each other's company, and no one is inconsiderate of anypony else.

If you try to be considerate of everypony to the best of your ability, that's true "good etiquette" - not showing favoritism to one gender or the other, no matter what your orientation is.
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