Discuss fanfiction, get writing advice, or get your story reviewed

Search /fic/ threads

Password  (for post and file deletion)

Mar 31With the Merger coming up soon, we have created an official steam group for the combined sites. It can be found at http://steamcommunity.com/groups/PonychanSteam

File 137775590367.png - (1.13MB , 900x1260 , 302807__UNOPT__safe_rainbow-dash_parody_cutie-mark_game-of-thrones_517203f7a4c72da3d4000534.png )
128209 No. 128209 [View]

I'm kinda torn, /fic/.

Lately I've been trying my hoof at writing attempting to write epic fantasy, and I've found that I really like it. Writing it has given me a new appreciation for the genre.

Now on the one hand I really want to write an original story so I can really stretch my legs in worldbuilding. I mean there's only so much I can do with The Crystal Empire. But on the other hand I still really want to write about the canon characters. I've never really written about most of them, and am only just now* writing about any of them seriously. But I feel like I can't really do both.

What do you think?

*i finished the first chapter of the wings of lulamoon, my first real attempt at writing twilight and trixie around the beginning of july.
3 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 128231
>How do I get better time management skills?

Write by egg timer. Do the set up part first. Outline to your heart's content.

Outline everything, outline things you aren't even planning on doing, outline a trip to your grandparent's house, just have a plan.

Then sit down and write one of them for... lets say a hour at a time. The tick tick of the clock can be an incentive. Then you can mix it up at will.
>> No. 128233
There's the aspect that a lot of people waste a lot of time in their daily activities. Do things then hop onto other things. Don't linger or dawdle in daily activities and you'll find yourself with an extra hour or more each day.
>> No. 128236
Two words: will power. Or you could just hire a personal assistant, but honestly the only way you're going to get better time management skills is simply to sit down, come up with a plan, and then stick to it. Yes, Technically willpower is one word. Mreh! The point is that you simply need to want something bad enough. If you lack motivation, nothing will get done. Speaking of, I never went back to that writing group I started after I got back from Bronycon. I kind of put down the pen there. Shame. I was getting somewhere. Anyway, an hour a night is a good start. pick an hour, and consistently commit that hour to nothing but writing. I would also recommend reading time as well, but that's only because I've recently rediscovered my love of reading.

File 132802361683.png - (605.76KB , 983x830 , tickets_to_your_friendship_by_ctb_36-d493d9y.png )
80935 No. 80935 [View]
#Discussion #Normal
Hi guys,

My fic was recently posted on EQD, and currently sits at 81 ratings, 4.7 stars (very proud!). The tag still says star-needed, so I was wondering if someone could tell me how the star system works, and when the star-needed tag is likely to change?

If anyone wants to give it a look it's called "Scootaloo in Cloudsdale". If anyone wants to rate it, then all the better!

>> No. 80936
Ask a pre reader thread would've been a good place to ask, but I'll give u an answer anyways. Because I can't be bothered to go find the thread on my phone. I like you.

For an update to the star rating I'm pretty sure you should just email seth asking for it to be updated. The ratings are rounded up after at least 50 are on the story, so you might even be listed as 5 star, enjoy.
>> No. 80937
File 132802455163.png - (75.50KB , 500x500 , mlfw1650-1316984301.png )
There's a pre-reader thread for these kind of questions. See the sticky.

It's okay to promote your story, but please follow the guidelines in the sticky.
>> No. 80939
heh, ninja'd

File 136943473168.jpg - (60.99KB , 830x650 , image.jpg )
127625 No. 127625 [View]
#Author #Anything

I am relatively new here, so give me some slack, but you my fellow brony friends, have found yourself a writer.
I will anything you want as long as it falls within my boundaries. Here's a list of what I will write:
Head cannons
Ship fics
Clopfics (no futa, scat, anthro)
Grim dark

If you have request, let me know and I'll get in it ASAP. When anything is finished, it will be on my pastebin. Also check it periodically to see if your request is up.
Fire away!

6 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 127684
a red haired, brown coated, oc with black hooves.
That sure is unique!(pony oc creator to.)
>> No. 127687
File 137014305968.gif - (1.53MB , 500x303 , 005[1].gif )
>it's been a week
>> No. 127712
File 137037156898.png - (212.77KB , 500x333 , 73a.png )
Well, don't judge a book by it's cover.
Well, always judge a book by it's cover, it's the only thing you have at first glance, just don't assume the insides match.
Everyone starts somewhere, and this is /fic/ not /art/.

No, no, it's cool. OP will deliver.

File 132934256816.jpg - (130.02KB , 859x929 , Granny Smith by apotropaic-puppet_at_deviantart.jpg )
84310 No. 84310 [View]
#Single fic #Shipping
Granny Smith lifted one hoof, sighed, and set it down again. The sloshing pack weighed heavy on her back. The aches and pains in her hip came to trouble her, but she knew how to deal with them. She waited. The pain would pass, just like everything else. Anyway, pain wasn't much to complain about. Pain meant you were still alive. That wasn't something she could take for granted at her age.
Berry Punch and Colgate tramped passed her. Heartstrings and Bon Bon overtook her. Even a flimsy unicorn could outmatch her pace. She sighed. She was almost there. It wasn't her fault they had moved the government buildings miles away from the edge of Sweet Apple Acres.
Rarity's Boutique loomed over her, all shiny and perfect like a ripe Honey Crisp apple. The dresses inside were unfathomable, confections of lace and gold thread more like wedding cakes or fine jewelry than anything a pony could wear. Granny Smith felt glad that her grand-daughter got along fine with that fancy unicorn with fancier aspirations. She didn't understand why they got along now, but she was still glad. She never found unicorns that easy to relate to, aside from the mouth-watering Sandy Banks, but he'd passed away decades ago.
Inside, a young stallion browsed around the male outfits. He snout was a little short, his eyes a little watery, but he had a smooth, golden coat and strong, thick legs. He reminded Granny Smith of her first husband.
Rarity moved in to close a sale. She reached one hoof over to gently brush the stallion's mane, a tender, restrained gesture. Everything about her was restrained. For a moment, Granny Smith wondered what it was like to be a unicorn, to have all that unseen power, and how much Rarity was holding back. She tossed aside such speculations like a rotten apple and continued plodding along.
A couple of decades ago, it seemed like yesterday, that Dress Boutique had been Black Cherry's Salt Lick and Saloon. All the women would trot in their after a long hot day of bucking hard labor. The applejack flowed like water, and the dancing stallions pran
8 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 86135
File 132989246492.png - (63.09KB , 500x580 , DerpFilly.png )
I see. Um, I feel stupid asking this, but I've been over the sticky thread and I still can't come up with the answer. How does one make a google doc and post it in an imageboard thread?
>> No. 86136
1. You make a google account.
2. You go to docs.google.com and sign in with that account.
3. You go to Create > Document, then type in what you want. It's like a Microsoft Word document.
4. You click on Share at the top right of the document, and have it so that anyone can view, with link or public. This is important, because otherwise, we won't be able to see it.
5. You post the link in the message box.
>> No. 86137
-- docs.google.com
-- New document
-- Dump story with copy–pasta
-- Click "share" (top right) and enable public viewing
-- enable commenting (change "Can view" to "Can comment")
-- Dump URL wherever

File 134708832161.png - (231.92KB , 530x432 , Rarity-sadface.png )
118831 No. 118831 Autosaged [View]
Yeah, so this is basically going to be me ranting about how I’m feeling about myself right now. I don’t expect you to care; I don’t expect you to respond. I don’t even expect you to read this, I just need to say it, and I’m a lot better at typing than talking. Also, it’s 2:30 am—or it was when I started typing—so I’m not mentally as stable as I should be.

I’ve been fighting with myself for some time now over whether or not I should even continue this whole writing shtick. I thought myself a decent writer when I came here; I graduated high school with top marks, I got straight A’s. Okay that’s not true; I never managed high honor roll, but I was on the honor roll, and I was always top of my class as far as English was concerned. I always did well on my tests, I got great scores on my essays; I was always 20 pages ahead of the rest of the class on whichever book we were reading. Yada–yada, I was a brilliant English student. So why am I tooting my horn? Because I always loved to write, and while I wasn’t the world’s greatest writer, I always got good feedback on various fan fictions I wrote for various T.V. shows... until I came here.

Yes, you all showed me what a terrible author I am was. And upon entering the write-off that Roger opened up, I realized just how outclassed I was. Not to mention I found several authors—such as SS&E—who were so far ahead of the game I could never dream to achieve such heights. Did that stop me? Hell no. I’d had and still have thicker skin than most ponies I know, and I plowed on like there was no tomorrow. And yet, I’ve still gotten nowhere. I understand that I’ve improved a lot as a writer—many thanks to all of you—but I’m struggling a lot with being late to this fandom, and behind the times on a lot of story ideas that have been done so often they’re cliché to the point of becoming painful to read. It’s at the point now where you have to actually have the best thing since sliced bread to get any attention at all, but that’s not my problem.

My problem lies in that I only ever get recognition whe
22 posts omitted. (View thread)
>> No. 118943
I understand the want to get noticed, we all do. What you've really got to revel in is the small things, because they come most often. For me a small victory is a well thought out comment explaining why someone liked the story, or a new follower on fimfic. Enjoy the little things, because the big things are too few and far between.

My current little thing is that RBDash47, someone I respect, started following me on fimfiction this week. What's your little thing?
>> No. 118946
This thread has, of course, already served its purpose, but there's a certain matter that I ways like to weigh in on : writing for fun, or more generally, why you write.

write because you want to write well. write because you grow from everything you write. When you write something, love it and try to make it the best you can. That is why you write: you write because everything you write helps you grow.
>> No. 129986
<a href=http://djsonny.com/#6ojifa>external link</a> retin a for acne results - buy retin a no prescription

File 136018619932.png - (1.05MB , 801x997 , Flutterride.png )
126497 No. 126497 Autosaged [View] [Last 50 posts]
Greetings all, and welcome to the Training Grounds, the review thread for all authors, reviewers, proofreaders, and editors, both newcomer and seasoned veteran alike. It isn't the only such thread, but it's usually the busiest! (Previous edition of The Training Grounds; The sticky, which contains important information)

If you're a reviewer, old or new, and you want feedback on your review, please put a "*" at the front of the subject line of your review post.
For writers:
Submission guide | TL/DR of the submission guide | List of TTG regulars | Submission form | List of recently-finished reviews | Reviews in progress
For reviewers:
How to review | List of unclaimed requests
For Maintainers:
The full, current active queue | Statistics and queue-dump text for thread updates | A guide to how it's all organized
Live communication:
The IRC channel
Some Notes:
408 posts omitted. (View thread)
>> No. 128055
NEW THREAD!!! >>128053
>> No. 128056
Dude, you have to go bigger than that.

NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!! >>128053 NEW THREAD!!!!!!!
>> No. 128202
You have been claimed. Natch.

File 133905047200.png - (341.88KB , 900x1238 , 132001648601.png )
105723 No. 105723 [View]
Content delivery is something that a lot of people seem to have thoughts about, but we have never had a very structured discussion and outlining of what exactly we want from these services. For that sake, I propose this thread. The goal of this thread is to develop, brainstorm, and discuss ideas related to content delivery with specific thought to Fan-fiction. It’s a very tough question to answer, but I think that having only one type of content (stories) makes a solution plausible. (Contrast with reddit, which has many different types of content.)

Here is my little brainstorm:

The goal of a content-delivery system should be to autonomously find and deliver rich content that users want to read.

The type of data used is probably the most important thing. Why? Because most of it is garbage. Garbage in, garbage out. How can you possibly model a system off of bad data? There is countless evidence towards an unfiltered democracy always pandering to the lowest common denominator (See: Fimfiction, default subreddits). With smaller populations it works, but as the user base increases, the signal to noise ratio always decreases. Popular solutions are exclusivity (SomethingAwful forums), or segregation (using smaller chans, smaller boards, smaller subreddits, etc.). Perhaps simply having more options than what we have now is a solution. (Here's hoping The Pegasus Quill or The Solar Flare be these alternatives.)

If we are to have a system that's entirely autonomous, there must be some way of filtering the good data from the bad.
23 posts omitted. (View thread)
>> No. 105877
Yes, but the Featured system exacerbates the issue.
>> No. 105927
File 133921278853.gif - (276.57KB , 400x300 , 1329526793857.gif )
Neat. I have power over your emotions.
>> No. 128183
Hello. And Bye.

File 137689540622.png - (268.05KB , 960x640 , 2013-04-23 22_35_08.png )
128139 No. 128139 [View]

This is my first time on this board cuz yesterday I just read my first fanfic!

It was "My Little Dashie" and I thought it was very good and it lived up to the hype.

Are they're any other classic fanfics like this that I can read for my next?

I liked the real world crossover aspect, but I don't think I would have liked it if it referenced another show or something...

Shipping is OK with me, as long as the story is good.
2 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 128143
If you're a fan of comedy, and you enjoyed the real world crossover thing (and if you're a fan of pinkie pie) you might enjoy this one by Hoopy McGee. It's a bit of a read for a new reader, but if you enjoy the first chapter, odds are you'll end up consuming the whole story.


Last edited at Mon, Aug 19th, 2013 10:49

>> No. 128152
so far so good.
thanks for the tip stranger
>> No. 128167
File 137741767505.png - (277.19KB , 558x299 , face.png )
>You may need to refine your tastes

>but that happens over time anyways
Boy I hope so.

Here, I've got a quick and wonderful one for you. It's comedy, it's by one of the best writers in the fandom, and hopefully it'll cleanse your palate and prepare you to read actually good stuff.

My Little Dashie has an enormous hatedom. For good reason. But we'll discuss that later. For now, go read this. It's very short.


No. 128147 [View]
This place is going to rot, and the community as a whole here makes me sick. There is so much this place can do, but it has died because of the blind stubbornness of it's community members. no one comes here anymore, and those that do don't stay very long. Nothing gets done, and those that are most passionate about doing anything are slapped for being wrong, and their ideas shot down or ignored. I used to love /fic/, but now I've finally given up hope. This board will never be revived, and it disgusts me.
5 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 128157
File 137720050081.jpg - (1.27MB , 1300x1600 , K-ON!_full_239717.jpg )
To be honest, the only reason to have an image-board dedicated solely to My Little Pony kinda died when /mlp/ was born. And why have review threads anymore when it's much easier to just ask someone for a private review?
>> No. 128159
File 137720656112.jpg - (17.70KB , 461x346 , 12011212_gal.jpg )

>To be honest, the only reason to have an image-board dedicated solely to My Little Pony kinda died when /mlp/ was born.

Heresy, I say! Blasphemer!


But you do have a point. Not that I'd want /fic/ to be rolled up into /mlp/. That place is horrifying. But /fic/ needs to grow beyond its MLP roots. It needs to spread its wings to become a full-fledged creative writing board. Being handcuffed to EqD and hogtied by fimfic is completely suffocating us at the moment. While it does give us all common grounds and a common vocabulary to use, and even a well-worn and well-known system to utilize, I still believe there is so much more, if we simply reached farther.

To you, OP. You don't have to be here. And you can't like a board or its community without liking the people who make it up. What you see is what you get. If you think you can do better, by all means please do create your own writing group. If you are successful, maybe some of us would join you. But not after this. Because this is just being an arse.
>> No. 128184
File 137758472918.png - (42.60KB , 122x128 , ponimarillion-faust-logo-blue-2a.png )
I don't know much about /fic/, all I know is I came back here for the first time because of a fic I'm working on for the first time (haven't written fiction before, but I've essayed a lot of parody and so forth and I've been working on this one in little scraps since early 2012) which I wanted to do as a /collab/ -- and a quick check in on /fic/ confirms my suspicion that it would probably do better in /collab/ because it's an incomplete fic, it's fairly ambitious and I wanted to work on it with other bronies if and when I run up against any obstacles (pic related). So I'm assuming it doesn't belong in /fic/. Which is a pity because the folks on /oat/ were very supportive, which I wasn't expecting; but yeah it doesn't fit in with the typical approach I'm "supposed" to take as a "fan fiction writer". I don't even like the label fanfic (but I won't complain about that.)

the laissez-faire, sink or swim, "rules of screenwriting" mentality, this is the way it's gotta be, culture of fan fiction sites and fan fiction pre-reading tends to militate against such notions. So if /fic/ is not a good home for even discussing something like the fic I wanted to work on, then that's probably an example of why people don't come here often, because they feel it's not welcoming to people like them -- on top of the barrier to entry presented by people who are unfamiliar with image board culture -- of course this helps weed out a lot of awful dreck that would otherwise get posted here -- but still...

OP is being a dick, but sometimes it's good to put a bug under people's butt. I do it all the time at the place I work at (which usually results in people responding angrily and doing the opposite of the intended effect, so there you go.)

That being said, the rules are very limiting and I find the "rules" and community enforced notions adhered to by critics on "official" fanfiction sites to be limiting to my intellectual curiosity, it's one of the reasons I no longer care for the culture on tvtropes. Probably because fan fiction sites tend to be kno

File 136912277038.png - (274.42KB , 525x900 , pinkiewasabroccoli.png )
127602 No. 127602 [View]

There's this story of Dustin Hoffman. He had this part where his character hadn't gotten any sleep the night before and was beating himself up over some grievance that occurred in the movie.

The day they were shooting the part, Dustin comes in looking like shit. Another actor asks what happened to him, and he replies, "Well, my character hasn't gotten any sleep and beat himself up, so I did likewise to be ready for the part."

The other actor replied, "Oh, Dustin...have you tried _acting_?"

I'm writing a story, I know from an intellectual level what my character is supposed to be feeling, but I feel like unless I get myself in the same mood, I can't write it.
3 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 127774
File 137116555546.png - (52.49KB , 633x578 , 132657495149.png )
Sit down and write.
Write anything
Make it simple to last your whole life long.
Don´t worry that it´s not good enough for anyone else to read.
Just write, write a...

Wait, or is that just the lyrics to Sing A Song? Either way, the advice is the same.

If you can't write the thing you logically want to write, write a different thing for a while.
>> No. 127851
If it helps any, that story is apocryphal. Hoffman and Olivier had a good rapport on the set of "Marathon Man," but screenwriter William Goldman did not get along with Hoffman, and told the story in the worst possible light.


(Goldman is my writing idol, and anyone who writes would benefit, IMO, from reading his "Adventures in the Screen Trade.")
>> No. 127920
>I'm writing a story, I know from an intellectual level what my character is supposed to be feeling, but I feel like unless I get myself in the same mood, I can't write it.
Read as much stuff about that "mood" to make it easier to write.

Reading is to the author like concrete is to the builder.

File 137593567503.jpg - (7.03KB , 225x225 , Twilit Sperkle.jpg )
128091 No. 128091 [View]
#Discussion #Grimdark

Am I the only one who's heard of some creepy little fanfic called "The Experiments of Twilight Sparkle"?
>> No. 128092
It'd help if you had a link to it.

No. 127270 [View]
#Discussion #Sad #Sci-fi

Hello I have been working on this fic for a while. So any one want to review it or give me any tips. :D
17 posts omitted. (View thread)
>> No. 127426
Mm... My only comment:

Keep writing. Don't pause for criticism yet. The story needs more time to cook, and your million-word purgatory is far from over.
>> No. 127427
File 136685549498.gif - (387.98KB , 425x260 , I'm bored.gif )
You present me with a war and no reason to care. You give me an anthro race I've never heard of: thus I cannot visualize or care about him either.
Everything has gone to hell and it's because of humans.
You make a painfully obvious Star Wars reference.

Here's the eight deadly words: I Don't Care What Happens To These People.
No meaningful conflict, no story.

For reference: http://tvtropes.org/pmwiki/pmwiki.php/Main/EightDeadlyWords

Last edited at Wed, Apr 24th, 2013 20:53

>> No. 127442
File 136716980169.jpg - (144.99KB , 630x886 , alrighty-then.jpg )
BTW that gif is so cute

Last edited at Sun, Apr 28th, 2013 10:24

File 137687257017.png - (186.15KB , 900x567 , aplle family.png )
128136 No. 128136 [View]
Hello, I recently just wrote two fanfics, and I'm pretty new at writing fanfiction. So, guys, is this good or bad fanfic? Here is the link to my fanfic:

>> No. 128137
Please move this thread to /fic/ thank you.
>> No. 128138
*skims first few paragraphs*
question: Is English your first language?
I ask because your sentence structure indicates that it is not; You commonly use the wrong tense for verbs, and some of your sentences would be read better backwards.
>> No. 128141
File 137690606283.png - (38.72KB , 345x440 , 132657475598.png )
Well, I hate your back story, that doesn't help your situation much. ^^ And I haven't even read that far in yet.

Sure, contextually, everything is in close enough place. It's not a horribly bad fanfic. It's just made of the basic components of things that aren't fun to read.

> This is the official website for my fanfic, My Little Pony - Adventures in Equestria. This is the fanfic that I right, therefore if you don't like it, then don't read it. And I hope you enjoy!
This is a really bad place to have a typo of this magnitude. One writes when they are an author.

Lets see: Your first chapter, apparently, is a script formatted revision of the first episode of FiM, replacing Rainbow Dash with Firefly. Doubly odd when Pinkie isn't Surprise, Fluttershy isn't Posey, etc... Twilight Sparkle might be Twilight, as you never describe the characters in this terribly phoned in first chapter.

Moving on, your History of Ponyland makes me want to immolate myself. Unnatural levels of importance is placed upon Star Swirl while describing your OC version of Solaris. Such enough that actually contradicts information in the S3 finale. Don't get me started on the G1 side of my brain, it already hates your story as it stands.

'Return of Tirek' makes me want to kill the English language. ^^

File 137306463945.png - (352.50KB , 1280x720 , Rainbow_Dash_enjoys_reading_S02E16.png )
127984 No. 127984 [View]
#Reviewer #Normal #Sad #Comedy #Sci-fi #Shipping #Grimdark

Bored. It's summer and I need a project.

I'll review the first three stories posted, at least. If I have more time I'll review more.

If your story will be a series and you'd like help through every installment, I will take one to work with you until the end, through email. Just specify that you'd like that, along with where I can contact you at. This is NOT first-come first-serve, but based on my own opinion. I'd love to help someone with their story though, so don't be afraid to ask. The worst that can happen is I'll say no and only review a chapter or two.

I enjoy sad and grimdark, and will likely be the most critical of comedy.

I'm better at catching grammatical errors but I'll look at your plot and characterization and junk as well.

Please put it into a google doc and turn on comments! This will make it easier to point out specific errors or parts you need to change.
6 posts omitted. (Expand)
>> No. 128008
I'm coming out of fanfic retirement working on a new grimdark story based off Lovecraft... This time 'The Hound'. Am i right to assume this is a place to find test readers as well as proofreaders?
>> No. 128017
Yep! I proofread, and you could also go to the Training Grounds. If you're on FIMfic, there are different groups like the School for New Writers that would also be happy to help you out.
>> No. 128132

I did post this one to "Traning Grounds" already and to Bleeding Raindrops, too, but the latter stopped reviewing for now and the former thread just seems dead. In the case you still do some reviewing (it's still summer where I live, anyway), here is the story. It is darkish and quite short (2200+ words). I'd be pleased to get at least one outside opinion on it before I decide it's fate.


File 133998456394.png - (718.03KB , 904x937 , scrunchy_rare.png )
107510 No. 107510 [View]
#Discussion #Research
Continuing the work started here:

I found Rarity to have a much more complex speech pattern. Surprises abound. For example, Rarity does not really use endearments like Applejack. The list of five includes two that are specific to her closest relationships: Opal and Spike. The list:

my dear
>> No. 107573
>Continuing the work started here:
Then post it there. It's sunk, so a bump is fine, and there's no reason for you to need a second thread for a related topic.
>> No. 107577
Fairly certain I deleted this post. Huh.

>> No. 128128
Didn't even one of the show writers say they sometimes have difficulties writing for Rarity?

Though I've noticed in plenty of fanfiction, writers will have Rarity say "darling" in every other line of dialogue. Gets annoying fast.

Delete post []
Report post

[0] [1] [2] [3] [4] [5] [6] [7] [8] [9] [10] [11] [12] [13] [14] [15] [16] [17] [18] [19] [20] [21] [22] [23] [24] [25] [26] [27] [28] [29] [30] [31] [32] [33] [34] [35] [36] [37] [38] [39] [40] [41] [42] [43] [44] [45] [46] [47]